Speaker 1 (00:11):
Hi, Carly. Oh, hi. How are you? I'm doing well. How are you?
Speaker 2 (00:18):
Good, thanks.
Speaker 1 (00:19):
So excited to chat with you.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
Yeah, me too.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
Did you have any questions before we get started?
Speaker 2 (00:27):
I don't think so. I read through the email that you sent and poked around through some other client testimonials, and so I think good to go.
Speaker 1 (00:42):
Yeah, it's pretty conversational, pretty simple. We're really just trying to show other women that they're not alone in what they're suffering with. So we'll see that through your story that you share. You're willing to share whatever you'd like. And then we'll kind of get into why you decided to take this type of approach, kind of what you've tried before. I'm going to ask you just the same questions that were listed in the email, but one thing I'll say is we want to be a little bit cautious about saying the things that specifically helped you, because what people do is they listen to these calls and then they're like, oh, well, this helped her, so that's going to help me. And sometimes it does, and also sometimes this contraindicated for what they need. So it's okay to, I'm not saying don't share what helped you, but I had a client on and she was like, I took magnesium, I took this, and I took that, and she named all the things that I'm like, yeah, and that was really great. It helped you, but also we don't want to anyone to think that this is what they need, because sometimes those make things worse.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
They're
Speaker 2 (01:49):
Like, okay, all I need to do is this, and then I'll have the same experience kind of thing. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (01:53):
Yeah. And it's really just we will end with the hopefulness. And I have some quotes that I was going to share. If you're comfortable based on things that you said, I'm happy to read them to you first if you'd like that there's no personal information in there, but there are some really good quotes if you don't mind me sharing.
Speaker 2 (02:14):
Of course. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (02:15):
Okay. Do you want to hear them first to remind you? Sure. Either one. Okay. So let's see. So in session two, you were saying, my skin is even getting better.
Speaker 2 (02:28):
Understand.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
In session three, you said, I didn't have any suicidal ideation,
Speaker 2 (02:32):
Such
Speaker 1 (02:33):
A reduction in anxiety, and from severe to mild irritability. So inspiring. And session four, you said, I can compartmentalize now, I'm not filled with rage. You said I feel better than I ever did on antidepressant. Yeah. And then in session six, you said, I feel great, and I'm supposed to get my period tomorrow. Oh, I wasn't going to read that one, but I love that too. Okay. Well, yeah, you said, I cannot believe I'm having symptom free cycles without medication. So hopeful.
Speaker 2 (03:12):
And
Speaker 1 (03:12):
Then in our last session, I mean, there are so many would also So good. You said, I cannot believe I lived that way for so long. You said Our house has a happier energy. My husband and my relationship is much better, and I don't have any severe symptoms like what I know. Yeah. So it's fun to get hyped up before we get into the recording. But yeah, those were so good. I was like, I think it will be helpful to just, if it flows in with the conversation, walk them through the progression of what came out of this and then elaborate on it with your own words.
Speaker 2 (03:54):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (03:55):
Any questions? No, I don't think so. Okay. You're looking so cute. So good to you. Oh, thanks.
Speaker 2 (04:03):
Thanks. I washed my hair last night,
Speaker 1 (04:06):
So beautiful. I see some curls trying to come on.
Speaker 2 (04:09):
They are. I've been just going with the air dry and apparently my hair is wavy. Who knew?
Speaker 1 (04:15):
Love it. Well, I'm biased, but
Speaker 2 (04:18):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (04:19):
All right, Carly, well, we're already recording. So what I'll do is I will just introduce you. I'm just going to say, hi, this is Carly, one of our one-to-one clients, and she's here to share her story with us today, and then we'll dive right in.
Speaker 2 (04:32):
All right, sounds great.
Speaker 1 (04:33):
I take a drink
Speaker 2 (04:35):
First. Yeah, that's idea.
Speaker 1 (04:41):
Alright, I have my fidget toy and I have mine. Yes. Go team. So on the same page. I love it.
Speaker 2 (04:53):
Yes, we are.
Speaker 1 (04:55):
Awesome. Okay. Hello, this is Jess with her mood mentor, and today I'm meeting with one of our one-to-one clients and PMDD rehab students. Carly. Hello Carly. Hi. So excited to chat with you today and first of all, just thank you for being here, raising hope in the community and being willing to share your story because it's such an inspiring one.
Speaker 2 (05:19):
Well, thank you so much for having me. I'm really excited.
Speaker 1 (05:22):
Yay. Okay, well let's get into it. So PMDD symptoms, how have they impacted you for how long? When did you know that this could be PMDD? Work us through how this played out for you.
Speaker 2 (05:37):
Okay, so my PMDD symptom story is a little different than so many of the other ones that I've heard because it started so long ago. So I fortunately was able to identify that I had PMDD symptoms or that I had PMDD when I was between 16 and 18. I was in high school and I had a therapist who without me knowing was tracking my symptoms and then pointed out like, Hey, from your sessions, it really seems like your symptoms are following a pattern. And there's this newer diagnosis of PMDD. This was in the early two thousands. She was like, it sounds like this really applies to you. So I was able to pinpoint that it was an issue, but my only available interventions were always consistently SSRIs and birth control. And so with that being the only thing available and not wanting to live under this insane PMDD fog, I went for it.
Speaker 2 (06:51):
And of course my symptoms got better, but it was kind of playing whack-a-mole because then other things would get worse. So if I missed a dose of my antidepressants or missed a dose of birth control, I'd be spotty or have these crazy dizzy spells or just not feel myself for a period of time. My life was dictated by the medications, which it was working. So all things considered that was better relationship than the ones that I was having with my symptoms, but not the best case scenario of course. And then so I kind of went through a period where I was like, I don't want to be on meds anymore. I feel I just would love to have my body be just organically functioning like itself. So I would try to come off of both of those things and it wouldn't go well, and I would really try, but it'd be every single month, this period of no less than two weeks where I would feel like a completely different person.
Speaker 2 (08:05):
So filled with rage, so short tempered, so sad, and I had my natural personalities very bubbly and outgoing and optimistic. So trying to keep that up while feeling so awful was like a one two punch. You're being taken out every month by your hormones, but then here you are still trying to pretend like everything is okay and not let people know what's actually going on. And I would just dread my period every single month and it just felt like I had no control over anything going from feeling on top of the world or my best self. And then a switch would go off and I would spend the entire rest of the day filled with rage and having no motivation and just completely powerless against my symptoms. And that went on for about seven, I'm 35 now, so 18, almost two decades.
Speaker 1 (09:18):
Yeah, I'm getting goosebumps. Oh, it's so long. And I think you don't see the cost of that, right? But it's like the relationships that were impacted, working towards your goals, believing in yourself, having consistent income from a job, everything in your life is impacted when for two weeks of every month you're debilitated to some degree it sounds like quite debilitated in your case for nearly two decades.
Speaker 2 (09:57):
And I'd be living, there has to be something wrong with me then, right? Because nobody else that, no other woman. And of course now we realize that there are more women who have been struggling with the same types of things, but just not likely to talk about it, which was my early experience. So then to go through all of those years thinking that there is something fundamentally wrong with you. I don't get to have a normal menstrual cycle. PMS, everybody's familiar with PMS. You have a few days of irritability or whatever, or you might not sleep as well, but the symptoms aren't clinically significant. You can still function. And then to have something that you have no control over being so clinically significant where it impacts your relationships, it impacts your ability to work to just do the day-to-day stuff to function and being like, what is wrong with me? And then the only things that your doctors tell you are available are SSRIs and birth control. And it's like, so I need to be dedicated to these pharmaceuticals to have a seemingly normal menstrual cycle. It just felt really, really defeating.
Speaker 1 (11:11):
Well, and your story is so unique because the fact that your provider that early in your journey not only knew about PMDD way back when, but was monitoring you for it and talking to you about it and then providing treatment at an early age and then to see it still impact you the way that it did, even with, because so many people are in the position where they're like, well, if I could have been helped sooner, but you were helped sooner, and this still and medication can be lifesaving, it's great. We're not, but it wasn't the answer, it wasn't the solution. It was a piece of your puzzle, but yet you were still suffering very badly during that entire early 20 year period.
Speaker 2 (12:02):
And you know this from us working together, but everybody else, but even when I went for my yearly O-B-G-Y-N visit in the middle of us going through this process together, and still the only recommendations that she had were SSRIs and birth control. So now here we are 20 years later, and I'm educating her about, I was like, oh, well, how about protein for my rage seems to be really helping. And she was like, huh. And nothing against her. I think she's absolutely wonderful. I have a great relationship with my OB GYN, but just that there's such a lack of knowledge and education there goes to show that there's not necessarily anything that's going to come different from the medical standpoint, at least where things are now.
Speaker 1 (12:56):
Yeah, I think there needs to be, and I don't know where this education would come from, but it would've helped me. It would've helped you so much earlier to just be like, okay, people work within their scope, this you're a practitioner. People work within their scope. This is their scope, diagnosing and treating with medication, and they don't have that much education actually on the menstrual cycle. Even an ob, GYN is a surgeon. You would be surprised the lack of education they have around the menstrual cycle and hormones and they're not a nutritionist. And so there's a lot of these, and we talk about this so often in our sessions because if you're listening, and I hope it's okay to share this, Carly, but you're a counselor, you're a licensed counselor. And so we've talked a lot about how there's this disconnect between the mental health profession world and the body, the physiology, and what the physiology needs to have a healthy brain.
Speaker 1 (13:48):
And again, not your OBGYN's job, but what happens is we become so victimized, we feel like I am I asking for help? I'm going to the appointments. I'm shelling out the money, I'm taking the time off work and I'm getting nowhere, and we turn it back on us. Oh, well, it's because I'm not trying hard enough. I'm not good enough. These things don't work for me. Whatever the narrative is when really it's just like, Hey, we're really going into a cake shop and being like, I need donuts. I'm looking for donuts. And they're like, cake. We have cake. More cake, more cake, more cake. And we need solutions that they're not offering. And that's as simple as it is. And it's not about you. It's not about the listener, it's not about the doctor or any practitioner. They're doing their job and you might need something that they don't offer and they don't have skills in, but it holds us back and it costs lives ultimately.
Speaker 2 (14:43):
Yeah, totally. There were months where I, and this was not an isolated, it became pretty much standard where I wouldn't even want to be alive and not because I didn't love my life. I love my life. And I think if anybody who knows me hears that they're going to be almost knocked on their feet, that I would ever feel that way. But I did. I would be walking my dog and be like, I wouldn't mind if a bus just came and hit me right now. I'm so sick of feeling like this and I have no way out. So it was never to actually end my life, but it was just to end this period of hopelessness and despair that I was experiencing just constantly. And then you have a period of a few good days, and you'd think that that would be relieving, but it's not that that's only going to be, it's such a time limited thing, and before you know it, you're going to be right back in the depths of despair and your doctors can't help you. They can only give you so much. And so what do you do? Like you said, I'm a licensed counselor, so when I hear things, maybe just get a new therapist or you need some new coping skills, I'm like, I am trained in the coping skills and I'm doing them and it's not enough. Somebody please help me.
Speaker 1 (16:05):
Yeah, yeah. The hopelessness that's perpetuated is really the precursor to the suicidal ideation that I see. And also the negative thinking loop that you get in that then perpetuates that hopelessness even more. And that's one of the reasons why you came here. The suicidal ideation was a factor that was scary. You're a mom, you are building it. You have a thriving business. You are in a marriage. All the things that require you to be there and show up as yourself. And it's also really interesting hearing you say that if people in my life knew that I was facing this, they would be shocked because it doesn't match my personality and I mask that as much as possible. And I think that weight, we've talked about this too, but that weight of carrying that and holding that is so much internal stress on the body and so sad for us that we're suffering in silence like this, rather than being like, guys, I'm drowning. I don't know what's happening. You're going to the doctor, but it can be harder to go to your family or go to your husband and say, Hey, this is actually happening and I don't know what to do. But that silence again, it perpetuates more hopelessness and more suffering. So it's just like it's a mucky situation, isn't it, Carly?
Speaker 2 (17:31):
It is. Yeah. Like you said, it unfortunately cost somebody their life. It can cost somebody their job, it can somebody their relationship or if they're your romantic relationship or your relationship with your kids, your relationship with your friends, it has a hand in impacting every part of your life if it's not controlled,
Speaker 1 (17:54):
The days that you lose fighting. Yeah. So what was the turning point? What was the like, okay, I have to try a new way. We ultimately did the root cause work, but what led you to shift gears into that realm after trying the medications, trying the therapy, trying the coping skills, trying the exercise regimens, all the things
Speaker 2 (18:19):
It got to, it was this past year, so the end of 2024 right after Christmas, and we were going on a road trip and right before we left, my husband and I had a quick conversation about potentially expanding our family, and we were on completely two different pages where he was like, I don't see this as a possibility and not act towards me. He knew that how much I was struggling, but he was like, genuinely, I don't think that our marriage could survive another pregnancy with how much of a toll it takes on your body, how dysregulated your hormones are, how much that took a toll on our relationship. And I remember in that moment being so gutted because I was like, this thing that I don't have control over could ruin and rob me of the life I've always imagined for myself. I never thought that I could get to a point where expanding my family and having the family I've always dreamed of having could be taken from me just because there's this thing that I had no choice over experiencing and all of the help that I've been trying to get and not been able to find anything that's really works across the board could cost me this life I've always wanted to live.
Speaker 2 (19:48):
And that just was like, I have to find a way through this. I can't keep living this way. Plus it was in the middle of the winter, so the seasonal effective stuff was piling on. And so I was just like, well, where can I try to get some extra information? Let me go try to find a podcast.
Speaker 1 (20:15):
So many GMOs already stealing the life away that you had envisioned and dreamed of for yourself. That is quintessential to the pmm DD experience. And it's, it so often takes that degree of seriousness before we're drawing the line in the sand saying Enough is enough. I mean, not that you hadn't done all the thing you had been trying, but we can white knuckle it. We can suffer as women, we can bear the weight for a long time, but when these symptoms start hurting the people that we love or keeping us from the things we know that are meant for us, we're stamping our feet down. We're saying, Uhuh no more.
Speaker 2 (21:07):
This is
Speaker 1 (21:08):
Not going to be my life. And it takes a specific type of person and a specific type of place in life to get there. But you got there and what has been different?
Speaker 2 (21:21):
What's that?
Speaker 1 (21:21):
What has been different?
Speaker 2 (21:23):
Oh, everything's been different. So from the moment I found that the first podcast that I listened to that you were on and started learning more about the pieces, the highs and lows of estrogen, dopamine, the relationship between PMDD and A DHD and being like, oh my gosh, this is the first. I was in tears listening to that because I'm like, for the first time, somebody's validating my experience and putting reasons behind it. So that makes me feel like there's help. And I think when you get to a point where you are that low and there's a beacon of hope, you do anything you can to fight for it. I think on our first meeting, I was like, Jess, you can tell me to wake up at four o'clock in the morning and go, no, my tree, eat some tree bark or whatever. And if that's what's going to help, I'll do it.
Speaker 1 (22:24):
Oh, you did? You did. Oh my goodness. I love your sense of humor. Yeah, yeah. There is a desperation that comes and it's uncomfortable to recognize that. But I also, the quote, rock bottom can be your trampoline and to you have to get to a point where you're ready to do the work because it's a lot easier to take a pill. And when we're really suffering, sometimes that's what we need. We need the medication to just prop us up a little bit so we're not falling below the surface of the water trying to survive. But beyond that, we have to start looking at, okay, what more can I do here? And not in a frivolous, I'm going to do all the things I'm going to change my whole life, but in a very targeted, specific way that is personalized to you. So you made the choice to come into our program to do the work.
Speaker 1 (23:26):
And what did you start noticing as you were going through the program with your symptoms? And I do have some fun quotes to read and little A DHD moment before we move on the podcast that you were mentioning, the divergent conversations will give them a shout out because if you are on the neurodivergent spectrum whatsoever, they have a fabulous podcast. And I did a talk on there about PMDD and A DHD and NEURODIVERGENCE in general, and that's what Carly is referring to. And we're both a DHD, we both have our fidgets on our call today. We're doing this. So it is a factor that we considered in your case, and we tailored our recommendations and everything around knowing that about you and your capacity as a mother and running a business, all the things. So as we did that, what did you start to notice with your symptoms?
Speaker 2 (24:24):
Immediately things started to improve from the first intervention of assessing my diet and just how much protein I was getting. And so finding these pockets of things to hone in on that was really what started the domino effect of things getting better. And it was even from just from that change and seeing the reduction, experiencing the reduction in my rage, I was like, okay, this did not a pharmaceutical insight. Again, not that there's anything wrong with pharmaceuticals As a licensed clinician, if you can't make your own dopamine store-bought is fine, totally support medications, but if I didn't need it to have the relief, then that was my goal. And so just seeing one change after the next with just some of those small things was really what got us jump started.
Speaker 1 (25:36):
Some quick wins where you felt like, okay, I am starting to have more control. I know what to do, how to do it, and it's not like we're changing your whole life to help you feel better.
Speaker 2 (25:47):
They were small, manageable changes, and it was a lot of work. Obviously the symptom mapping was huge. So finding out instead of just being at the mercy of my cycle, being able to see, hey, for consistent three months, days, two to four on your cycle are your hardest ones. I can plan ahead for that. So then if I wake up feeling not great, it's okay. We planned for this. This was expected. So it's not knocking me off my feet in the way that it was before where it would be like, why is this here again? When is it going to end? I could mentally know, alright, on day five I'm going to start to feel a little bit better. We're going to start coming out of the weeds. So the whole relationship with my symptoms changed, and then it got me to a place where the things that I was already doing to try to help myself feel better, the coping skills and whatever that looked like at the time were effective because it wasn't just the coping skills in isolation and not getting to the root of the issue.
Speaker 1 (26:50):
Yeah, yeah. You can't cope your way out of nutrient deficiency, which is what we saw a lot of with you.
Speaker 2 (27:00):
Yes, that was, and I never thought that my relationship with nutrients was bad. I had a pretty clean diet. I consider myself somebody who eats pretty well, but I wasn't looking at nutrients as self-care. It was just, okay, well, if you're hungry now, just eat something quick and get back to it. It wasn't prioritizing myself and my needs in the way. So when these symptoms would pop up, it wasn't like, oh, this horrible thing you can't control. It was, Hey, my body's asking for something extra now, and now I know what it's asking for and I can give it that, and then the symptom can go away.
Speaker 1 (27:46):
This is making me emotional, Carly, all of this conversation, but that shift is huge from something's wrong with me. I'm fundamentally flawed. The symptoms are attacking me. My body is against me to curiosity, what is happening here? How did I sleep? Am I hydrated? What nutrients is my body needing? You have a completely different way of interacting with the symptoms, which again, we can't quantify. It's not something we can hold in our hands, but that relationship change between the experience in yourself changes everything that comes next, not
Speaker 2 (28:22):
Only what
Speaker 1 (28:23):
You do, how you do it, how you talk to yourself, how you react within your family unit or the people that are around you. It is the catalyst to change. If your body is against you and you're fundamentally flawed, well, there's that nowhere to go from there. Too bad when you ask questions, lots of options.
Speaker 2 (28:48):
So true. And the options look completely different. Most of the time
Speaker 1 (28:55):
The options aren't, be better, try harder, change your life, divorce your husband, move to every country,
Speaker 2 (29:02):
Right? Yeah. Pack it all up. Just try
Speaker 1 (29:06):
Again somewhere else or burn it down. Choose how you want to do it. Yeah, it's very different. So by sessions, our second session, you said, my skin is even getting better by our third session, you said, I didn't have any suicidal ideation. You said such a reduction in anxiety, which is a major factor you were facing. Jump in if you want to add anything to any of these, but I'm just kind of going through the timeline.
Speaker 2 (29:41):
Yeah. Well, and in the reduction of the symptoms, it wasn't even my PMDD symptoms, it was my A DHD symptoms also started to improve, so usually I could tell that if I wasn't tracking my cycle, I could tell, all right, well, when you start to feel like the world is ending and nothing will ever be good again, and you can't concentrate on anything and you're completely fried, then it's probably coming. But now it was like, oh, my cycle started today, and I even, there were no warning signs. Here it is,
Speaker 1 (30:20):
And it's such a relief to hear that because I think we can get into this very myopic like A DHD needs, this PMDD needs this, right? My thyroid condition needs this, whatever it is, it's all very compartmentalized. But the reality which let's just say this again, for all those in the back for ourselves, the body's connected, okay? Your brain, your body, it's all in here. So everything that you do to improve your PMDD symptoms or your A DHD symptoms isn't only going to improve that one factor that you're facing. It's going to have this beautiful compounding effect on improving lots of other things, thank goodness, which really simplifies things because if we had to only do a certain set of things for this and only a certain set of things for this, nobody got time for that. We got to live our lives here.
Speaker 2 (31:13):
We had jobs and stuff,
Speaker 1 (31:15):
Yes, children and partners and jobs and houses to clean. So it's so exciting to see that because that also the A DH ADHD symptoms are impacting your quality of life in a huge way. Your productivity, your sense of self, your self-esteem, all of that, and you have goals. You came to this because you have things you're wanting to achieve, and both of these factors are holding you back from that, which this ties perfectly in the fourth session. You said, I can compartmentalize now, which whoa, jaw drop.
Speaker 2 (31:55):
Yeah. Yeah. The compartmentalizing is huge, right? Because when you can't do that, it seems like everything feeds into it. You can wake up and it's like you're waking up with glasses that taint everything you're looking at. If you're having a bad day, everything you look at is negative, but knowing that you can compartmentalize that into, it could just be a bad morning and I'm going to feel better after I eat breakfast or by tomorrow, this is going to have gone. So just give yourself grace today and don't try to recreate the wheel. You're going to feel better tomorrow. So that compartmentalizing is so, so important.
Speaker 1 (32:44):
When we're in fight or flight, we're so dysregulated, our symptoms are so severe, your brain isn't going to have the capacity to do that. It's just like survive. Survive, whatever you have to do to survive, and that drives a lot of pain. It drives narcissistic tendencies because you're trying to survive, which destroys relationships. It makes you cry in situations that are inappropriate. I remember just, I could never not cry. I would be working coffee shop jobs in high school or in college and just looking at people. I know she's in a breakup. I know his grandma just died and they're here and they're just working and I'm sobbing over whatever. Not as serious as either of those things, and I just couldn't understand how were people able to just, not to compartmentalize. It just wasn't something I could comprehend. But as you calm the nervous system, as you get the nutrients that you need, as you work on these things and you get some skills and coping skills, you can learn to compartmentalize and it can be such a weird experience to shift to,
Speaker 2 (33:52):
Right? Yeah. It goes not from like, oh, this is something about me going back to that I'm flawed. Everybody else can move through these experiences and seem okay, and I'm crying because I'm stuck in traffic or something, and so there must be something wrong with me. But know the compartmentalizing of your body's just asking for more. There's something else that it needs. So that's not something that's wrong with you. It's just something wrong that you are doing that you don't know, and it's not a fixed thing. It's fixable.
Speaker 1 (34:32):
You have an agency over figuring this out, but first you have to break that mindset loop of being fundamentally flawed and it being your fault. You also said, which this was such a win, you said, I'm not filled with rage, which we love, and you said, I feel better than I ever did on antidepressants,
Speaker 2 (34:57):
And that really didn't take that long. Usually once for anybody who's experienced being on antidepressants, there's that. There's the lag time. You start taking it and it gets into your system in a couple of weeks or maybe a month, and then you start to feel better. And this was such a quicker turnaround, and I just remember waking up one morning and being like, I have never felt this good, especially this close to my period, and I'm not medicated, and there's nothing else about my life within the past few months that has changed besides the way that I have learned to take care of myself and to show up for myself.
Speaker 1 (35:43):
I mean, empowering is so overused, but it's so inspiring and empowering for you to be the one to do that. It wasn't a doctor. It wasn't me. You learned how to care for yourself and you made yourself feel better than you had ever felt in lu deal. That kind of power after feeling so powerless and hopeless, that's the juice that transforms the rest of your life because it's like, okay, if you can do that, after 20 years Carly of drowning, you start to ask legitimately, okay, well, what can I not do? I just pretty much eliminated suicidal ideation without medication. I just learned how to care for myself and I'm not filled with rage anymore, right?
Speaker 2 (36:32):
Yeah. Like, oh, hey, we got in this minor scuffle today and I don't want to divorce my husband. That's a win. People don't just walk around thinking about divorce if they just have a minor disagreement. What do you mean?
Speaker 1 (36:46):
Yes. Yes. It's like the downward spiral with PMDD and you're experiencing the opposite, which is really an upward spiral as you're healing. I have a couple more quotes and then we'll move on to the hope that you have to share, but in this succession again ties into what we just said. You said, I cannot believe I'm having symptom free cycles without medication. So hopeful.
Speaker 2 (37:13):
So hopeful. It just really, and like you just said, after 20 years getting to that point, it was just insane. There's not even really a word to put through it because it's such a mixed bag of feelings. But to know that this was really all it took, and not to make it sound simple because it is a lot of work of course, but this is all, it took meaning in a few months period, if I really like buckle down and do these things and familiarize myself with myself and with my daily habits and with all of the other things that are coming into play, I can be living a completely different life and no doctor had to be involved in it.
Speaker 1 (38:09):
Yeah, I know it comes with grief because what about 20 years of Joanne, of this three months? What are you talking about? There is a searing to the reality of that. And also we're here, we're grateful we wouldn't trade it. You learn a lot. Maybe you were traded. I can't speak for yourself, but yeah, there are grief stages as we're healing this, and that's absolutely a part of it, and luckily because of your profession and because of the life that you've lived, you have lots of coping skills to navigate through those feelings. But it's something we talk about when you graduate out, like, Hey, feeling better isn't all rainbows and butterflies. There's some pain that comes with it.
Speaker 2 (39:02):
Yeah, there totally is. Not all the feelings that you're going to experience in that period are going to be similar, but they all have a place.
Speaker 1 (39:17):
So the last quotes I have was from our last session, and you said, my husband and my relationship is so much better, which I'm hopeful about the future of this family growing based on hearing that in your dream coming true, and you said, our house has a happier energy, which we love. You said, I don't have any severe symptoms, and when we started, there were three weeks of moderate to severe symptoms, and the last one like, oh, I cannot believe I lived that way for so long,
Speaker 2 (39:58):
For so long. And when you're in it and you're suffering in silence and you're doing the things and the symptoms are as bad as they are, there's a way to rationalize how you feel that justifies, especially just speaking to the rage, justifies the rage. I'm feeling this way, and it must be because this thing that you have said or done is just so awful. And then we know if you have PMDD, once those symptoms start to get better, then you have all that mess to clean up. And so now to be able to consistently for the entire month communicate better through hard moments and to have patience in the face of things that I had no patience for 20 years when I was getting around the time to or in luteal for that to all be different. I feel like it's such a gift for my daughter and whoever ends up coming after her, because it's like our household isn't just swinging in the breeze of mom's hormones where one day everything is fine and then it's like a switch flipped and she's got this irritable energy about her because even as much as we try to mask, especially with children, they know they can feel it.
Speaker 2 (41:26):
So the energy shift in our house is a gift for me, of course, but it's a gift for everybody, especially my daughter.
Speaker 1 (41:37):
I wear goosebumps. Carly, I'm going to start having to wear coats to these calls. It is, and should she ever face anything like you faced, she is going to be in such a different position with the knowledge that you now have, the skills, the awareness. She isn't going to suffer for 20 years like you did.
Speaker 2 (41:58):
Yeah. This community that you have created really is preventing generational suffering because we as women, once we can recognize these things and know what to do, not to say that the same protocol is going to fit for everybody. It's not necessarily a one size fits all approach, but to know that there are different interventions to explore versus what is given to you at OB GYN appointment is a game changer in such a significant way.
Speaker 1 (42:38):
Again, so many options from two to endless, overwhelming amount of options really,
Speaker 2 (42:47):
Especially when you've lived such a long period of time feeling like there aren't any or there's just this one specific one.
Speaker 1 (42:55):
Yeah, yeah. Well, and like you were saying since the medication that awareness was such a big part of your story. This is so hopeful for those who can't tolerate the medication side effects, because even there's a lot of people out there, they have positive effects, but maybe they don't want to be on them forever or maybe they want to have a child, so they need to come off of them for a period of time. There's a lot of fear there, but then there's a whole subset of us who have tried the medications and we can't tolerate the side effects or they make our symptoms worse, and there literally are then no options, none. It's just like that's that. Good luck. Go to counseling, which has its limitations as we know. So it's so hopeful to hear your story, to be, I mean, oh my gosh, it is so rare that you had that early diagnosis,
Speaker 2 (43:47):
So rare, especially in the time period that I was given it. I mean, I don't even know that it was in the DIAGNOS or Diagnostic and Statistical manual, the Bible for diagnosing disorders. It was so new even in that it just was not a part of the conversation. But even all the way back then, like I said before, 20 years almost has gone by and in the medical community, those interventions have not changed. So the more that we can talk about this, the more that people can understand that those aren't our only options, and if we are suffering and there are no options available to us, if you're somebody having the experience you just mentioned where medications, you can't find one that works well with your system, and there are so many people experiencing that to know that, then that doesn't mean that you have to continue to live the rest of your life like this, that you can still feel better. There's still hope.
Speaker 1 (44:57):
Absolutely. I mean, such relief, and I would say the majority of our clients are actually on medications for PMDD
Speaker 2 (45:05):
And
Speaker 1 (45:05):
They're still our clients. They're still here because it's not that there's ever a solving the problem. I think that's really the wrong way to look at this in general or health conditions in general, but it's not providing them the resources and the relief that they're ultimately looking for. So fun to talk to you is always such a good convo. To wrap up here, I'm wondering what message of hope you would like to share to others who are still suffering, thinking about yourself back five months ago in the winter, feeling the way that you were feeling kind of something you would like to say to her, believing that she was hopeless or saying to something to say to the other women out there who resonate with your story and still feel like, no, I've tried everything and this is how it's going to be for me.
Speaker 2 (45:58):
Just don't give up. Give on yourself. Even though you could be coming at it from a place where you feel like you've got nothing left to give yourself this gift of trying this way because there is so much hope and you don't have to suffer in silence and you don't have to be embarrassed. You should put words to your experience and talk about it instead of just living with a mask on and trying to force feeling like everything is okay or pretend you don't have to do that. There's nothing to be embarrassed about. It's not something fundamentally wrong with you. It's that the systems in place for whatever reason have failed us as women, and we don't have to stop there. There are options if you just stay committed to looking for the relief.
Speaker 1 (47:10):
Yeah. It's so easy to get caught in that hopelessness trap, especially when you're in luteal. You have to have that symptom mapping to be able to be like, yeah, here it is. Right on time. It is a predictable place that you're going to encounter if you have these symptoms, but it doesn't have, doesn't have to be your whole story. It can just be a 20 year part of your story.
Speaker 2 (47:34):
And if somebody gets this far and they're like, okay, that sounds all great, but it's a lot of work. It is a lot of work, but so is feeling miserable all the time, is a lot of work. So have it be a lot of work intentionally in a time limited period so that the rest of your life, the rest of your cycles don't have to be a lot of work.
Speaker 1 (47:57):
Yeah. Oh, that's such a good reframe. Like we said before, I think it's hard to quantify the cost and hard to, I think what I see a lot, especially in the pmm DD community, but just with women in general, is it's like, I don't deserve to spend this time or invest this money or time or whatever the conversation is on myself. I'll just figure it out. Oh, it'll just get better on its own eventually. And then we're not seeing all the days that we're losing. We're not seeing how this is impacting our parenting, our marriage, our relationships with our own parents, our friends, our work performance. It's not right there in front of us, clearly in a quantifiable way, and then we switch over to feeling ourselves again and we're like, oh, I just was overreacting. I was just making a big deal out of it. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (48:49):
How dramatic am I?
Speaker 1 (48:52):
We minimize our experience and it really, it's stealing lives. It's not only stealing, obviously, the lives of women who take their lives because of these symptoms, but it's stealing our own lives. If for two to three weeks you're not yourself, that over a 20 year period we can do that math, it's grim. It's grim. Half of over 10 years
Speaker 1 (49:18):
In a dark place kind of wasting away not towards your goals trying to survive. We can't quantify the impact that it has on our child rearing and their lives. We can't quantify the impact that it has on our marriage and the closeness and the support and on and on and on. There's huge hidden costs to this, and you're worth it. You're worth however much time it takes, however much money it takes, your life is worth that there couldn't be enough money or enough time that wouldn't be worth you having the life that you want and should have.
Speaker 2 (49:56):
So true if you could, and if it's a cost thing, maybe reflect on all of the things that you spend money on trying to make yourself feel better and know that those things are probably going to be pretty limited no matter what it is, but this could be an investment in the rest of your life and you really can't put a price tag on that. It's just so worth it. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Especially with how many resources there available. If one is not the best fit for somebody, don't stop there.
Speaker 1 (50:35):
Just some days I feel like Mary Poppins, I'm just like, what's in my bag for you today? This? That's actually one of the hardest parts of my job is I have so many resources, so many ideas, so many avenues that we can take based on what we're seeing in your symptom pattern, in your lab, work with your goals, with your specific symptoms. It's one of the most overwhelming parts of my job, snap my job now, is that how many options there were, and then to think back of myself just like you, 17 years going on, two decades of feeling like I had no options to now be in this place that's like this is some weird karmic retribution of like, ah, so many options. I'm drowning in them now rather than drowning from none. So
Speaker 2 (51:27):
Silly. Yeah,
Speaker 1 (51:30):
It is so silly. Well, thank you for being here. Carly, thank you for sharing your story. I know this is going to be such a breath of fresh air for those out there still suffering and yeah, I just can't thank you enough for showing up, for doing the work, for allowing me to be a part of your journey and your story. It's really been truly a gift and I'm so happy.
Speaker 2 (51:55):
Yeah. Well, and thank you so much because it has also been a gift to me and to so many other women that you work with. Like I said on our last session, of course, it's up to us as the clients to show up and do the work, right? But we wouldn't know what to do if you weren't leading the charge. So thank you for all of your work and your continued commitment to make PM MDD more of the conversation and get the word out so that more women can start getting their lives back.
Speaker 1 (52:31):
Yeah. No more time needs to be wasted to PM MDD.
Speaker 2 (52:35):
No, don't waste another cycle, ladies.
Speaker 1 (52:38):
Yeah. Well, I do want to say if it's okay for me to share this, if not, we can clip this out, but Carly is a licensed counselor in Connecticut who has lived with BMDD and A DHD, and if you're looking for support, if she has openings, I'm sure she would be happy to chat with you.
Speaker 2 (52:55):
Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 1 (52:57):
Awesome. So great, great to hear your story, Carly. Thanks again for sharing it.
Speaker 2 (53:04):
Thanks so much for having me, Jess.
